imported_beer
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Joined: 30 Jan 2006
From: Texas |
 Posted: Tuesday, 08 May 2007 03:37PM |
Before the previous thread diverted alarmingly to discussions of Saemon and prenuptial agreements, I was hoping to bait David Gaider into giving up *all* details on what was it about DA that merited a mature rating. Well, I tried.
So far, I have innuendoes, which could *potentially* be mature in content- but not always so. We have the term "Dark Fantasy" which is tantalizingly obscure when it comes to details. There are people joking about nudes in tents, profanity, and Chris Priestly suggested extra Rape but you never know with him
(Contrary to many jokes made here, mature can be very non sexual, *and* non-violent as well. Of course, that may not be fun, but still.)
And just in case Mr. Gaider cannot or is not ready to share his ideas at this time, anyone care to share theirs? What does Bioware need to do to merit an M rating in your mind- not those silly bodies that arbitrarily slap letters on everything.
Edit: Changed title a bit.  Edited By Chris Priestly on 05/10/07 20:10 |
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Nighteye2
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From: Nether Lands |
Posted: Tuesday, 08 May 2007 03:43PM |
Well, the inclusion of stylish, tasteful nudity at appropriate occasions would be nice - not having such things censored out.
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king of seals
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Joined: 28 Jun 2005
From: Italy |
Posted: Tuesday, 08 May 2007 03:54PM |
Quote: We're aiming for a Mature rating, so we're not avoiding any mature content if it serves our purposes -- but neither do we intend to dwell on it or use it in a gratuitous fashion. If a whorehouse is called for by the story, there will be a whorehouse, and it won't be just to see jiggly bunny-suited women bouncing about the bordello.
If they are actually aiming for a mature rating, violence and gore are probably going to be in.
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Stanley Woo
QA Ninja
Joined: 17 Oct 2001
From: The BioWare Compound |
Posted: Tuesday, 08 May 2007 03:55PM |
Quote: Posted 05/08/07 15:43 (GMT) by Nighteye2
Well, the inclusion of stylish, tasteful nudity at appropriate occasions would be nice - not having such things censored out.
Seen a lot of games with censored nudity lately? More than likely, developers simply don't include nudity. The only recent games I can think of with any kind of nudity are the two God of War games.
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Chris Priestly
Community Coordinator
Joined: 17 Oct 2001
From: Behind an Evil desk in Marketing |
Posted: Tuesday, 08 May 2007 03:57PM |
Quote: Posted 05/08/07 15:54 (GMT) by king of seals
If they are actually aiming...
We don't really ever "aim" to make a certain rating. We have always made the game as it needed to be and then worry about the rating after. This allows our writers, designers, animators, etc the freedom to make really excellent games.
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imported_beer
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Joined: 30 Jan 2006
From: Texas |
Posted: Tuesday, 08 May 2007 03:59PM |
I must say that the "dancer's outfit" in KOTOR2 brought my house to a standstill. It was not close to being a nude exactly, and Lu the Lotus Blossom was perhaps almost as revealingly dressed, but there were a lot of people who watched Leia in the old starwars movie, in her slave girl costume and that was far more um...erotic than absolute nudity. My husband took control of the PC and just made her run about for 20 minutes or so.
As for sending kids out of the room during that scene, my son gazed upon her with a lot of intensity and then told me she is going to catch a cold. (He *is* three)
About mature ratings, after playing Jade Empire, I was perplexed as to why it got an M rating. It was.. it was cheeky, but it was hardly something I'd get upset about if my teen son were playing it. The violence levels were not out of hand, it did not feature overtly adult situations or language. It was just a great game that never made me squirm.
Is DA going to be one of those M rated games, or is it going to take this to a new level?
Edit: after reading Chris' post, I realize the rating comes later and right now you are just developing the game according to your vision. However, what sort of direction is that taking, in this context?Edited By imported_beer on 05/08/07 16:02 |
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David Gaider
Lead Writer
Joined: 17 Oct 2001
From: Edmonton, AB |
Posted: Tuesday, 08 May 2007 03:59PM |
Quote: Posted 05/08/07 15:57 (GMT) by Chris Priestly
We don't really ever "aim" to make a certain rating.
Err... except for the part where I said we were aiming for a Mature rating. Which we are. More in the way of not worrying about including certain things than actively injecting them just to achieve a particular rating, of course, but it's still very much in mind.
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Maria Caliban
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From: In absentia |
Posted: Tuesday, 08 May 2007 04:04PM |
Quote: Posted 05/08/07 15:59 (GMT) by imported_beer
The violence levels were not out of hand...
The harmonic combos where your opponent explodes like a can of Chef Boyardee stuck in the microwave for ten minutes might have been the issue.
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Chris Priestly
Community Coordinator
Joined: 17 Oct 2001
From: Behind an Evil desk in Marketing |
Posted: Tuesday, 08 May 2007 04:05PM |
Which just goes to show I need to attend some DA design meetings.
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Like a great predatory piano, I sit silent in the darkness. Until it is time to attack and then I strike in a cacophony of violence and ivory keys. |
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I'a Dagon
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From: Texas |
Posted: Tuesday, 08 May 2007 04:12PM |
OK, I'm reposting this from the topic that got locked. That's what I get for thinking about my responses for too long.
In response to David:
I stand corrected. I admit I made certain assumptions based on what you said and the way others responded to it. If there is a mature discussion between mature adults which serves to advance the story, I don't have a problem with it. I may however have to send my kids out of the room while I'm playing DA. |
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king of seals
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From: Italy |
Posted: Tuesday, 08 May 2007 04:12PM |
Quote: Posted 05/08/07 15:59 (GMT) by David Gaider
Err... except for the part where I said we were aiming for a Mature rating. Which we are. More in the way of not worrying about including certain things than actively injecting them just to achieve a particular rating, of course, but it's still very much in mind.
Invariably, violence and gore are going to be the easiest way to achieve this rating.
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Lightzy
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Posted: Tuesday, 08 May 2007 04:13PM |
Acheiving an M rating in my mind has very little do to with romances in the game, which are a rather tacked-on and are of barely tertiary importance.
Being over 24 and having seem a lot of movies and television, I can definitely say I've never seen in any game a representation of violence, nudity or harsh language even coming close to things I've seen in movies or television..
And I can also say that without the violence, nudity and harsh language, those movies would have been pretty damn lousy.. So as David said, whatever the game calls for, the game should have. specific 'mature themed' ideas you can come up with have no real role to play here, because it's whatever the game calls for.
Otherwise its Fight Club without blood or red shoe diaries (boot? I can't recall.. never figured what the hell the x-files guy was doing there) without nudity.
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I'a Dagon
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From: Texas |
Posted: Tuesday, 08 May 2007 04:16PM |
Quote: Posted 05/08/07 15:43 (GMT) by Nighteye2
Well, the inclusion of stylish, tasteful nudity at appropriate occasions would be nice - not having such things censored out.
Search the internet. I hear that kind of thing is starting to appear. |
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imported_beer
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Joined: 30 Jan 2006
From: Texas |
Posted: Tuesday, 08 May 2007 04:18PM |
Violence seems reasonable . Of course a 14 year old can see worse on Robot Chicken/AquaTeen Hunger Force. And adultswim is rated 14 and above. But I get your point.
However, from what I gathered from developer posts, it seemed that the story itself was a bit more gritty and grown up. That makes me think that they believe DA is mature for reasons than bloody battle scenes.
Of course, I could be totally misreading this.Edited By imported_beer on 05/08/07 16:21 |
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Aedan mac Gabran
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Posted: Tuesday, 08 May 2007 04:19PM |
There have been a lot of threads on this subject and while BioWare has tried to say what they mean by dark fantasy without giving out many details, they haven’t been very successful. There have been a few things mentioned though, so here’s a combination of what they devs have said mixed with some of my own speculation:
-Not shying away from realistic gore in combat.
-More realistic take on religion with no obvious proof of gods.
-Political intrigue and human vs. human conflict.
-Magic is feared for its power and not used to perform common tasks
-Setting not trivialized by pop culture references and out of place humor.
-The common people are the first to suffer when things go bad, which presumably they will during the game.
-Not shying away from potentially contentious content such as rape (not shown on screen, hopefully) if it fits the story they want to tell.
-Realistic attire rather than highly stylized fantasy outfits. |
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